If i am correct, I dont think that Lady Marine officers flew missions in RVN.
Trying to firgue out this photo from a MCL MC Ball from last Fall. It appears to be RVN Ribbons/air medal/CAr & Purple Heart. Open for suggestions
If i am correct, I dont think that Lady Marine officers flew missions in RVN.
Trying to firgue out this photo from a MCL MC Ball from last Fall. It appears to be RVN Ribbons/air medal/CAr & Purple Heart. Open for suggestions
This sure looks strange. Especially since it was hard for a male Marine to get a CAR, let alone a female. I worked in vaious 1st Maw activities and never saw a female Naval aviator during three different tours in country.
Lot of discussion on another site.
From the discussion/Pic appears MCL in Ct have accepted his/her DD214.
One explanation might be that "she" earned the wings/awards when she was a he.
Assuming that's the case then the question is "if you are a former/retired Marine who served as a "he" and is now a she- can you wear a WM uniform
Slick
she/he
I was thinking of that very thought. But did not want to be on the list for being politically incorrect.
I was stationed at NAS Meridian, MS in 1973 when the first Navy female officer was selected to start flight school. It was a few years later that the first female Marines were allowed to go to flight school. So no female Marine aviators served in Vietnam.
There was a male Army pilot that flew in Vietnam, and in the 1980's she was a civilian flight instructor at Fort Rucker.
Maybe she's running for the senate
READY - SQUAT THRUST - BEGIN
I'm amazed that NO One has provided this site with a name of the person, her combat history and squadron she allegedly served with, the names of the Marines in the picture, the name of the Marine Corps League, and a copy of her DD-214 if she is legetimate!!!!!! Semper Fi
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="4"]So where is Sam Beamon on all of this?
Sam, you should really be proud of yourself. Is she in your book?
It appears the entire Connecticut Marine Corps League is just a bunch of chest thumpers wondering around the State comparing their dittle licks.
It would also seem that being a female(?) pilot in VietNam, with a Purple Heart and CAR, that she/he would have been well known.
Since she/he is not legit, then this is a violation of the Stolen Valor Act, MCI big nuts or not.
What a jucking foke![/SIZE][/FONT]
The Marine Corps League is the only federally chartered United States Marine Corps-related veterans organization in the United States. Its Federal Charter was approved by the 75th U.S. Congress and signed by President Franklin D. Roosevelt on August 4, 1937. The organization credits its founding — in 1923 — to legendary Marine Corps Commandant John A. Lejeune.
In Sam Beamon's defense, I know that he has examined the combat records of this UH-1E pilot from Vietnam. The Purple Heart is authentic, as is the Air Medal ribbon with Star - both have been earned in Vietnam. The name and squadron are being withheld at the individual's request.
Times have changed in the past 40 years, whether we like it or not. Things are now officially acceptable that at one time were not. Any attempt to discriminate against individuals based on gender/transgender in a federally chartered organization could be grounds for loss of charter.
I am not familiar with regulations regarding the wearing of Marine Corps or Marine Corps League uniforms in this situation. I am sure that someone out there has access to the official scoop on that issue; the proper wearing of the appropriate uniform. However, the displayed medals in this case have been earned.
"Some companies are grappling with how to manage employees switching from one sex to another. American Airlines and its HR people helped a 58-year-old pilot – an ex-Marine and Vietnam combat veteran – go from being Robert to Bobbi." Source: americansfortruth.com
Alan H. Barbour, Historian
USMC Combat Helicopter Assoc
SAEPE EXPERTUS, SEMPER FIDELIS, FRATRES AETERNI
"Often Tested, Always Faithful, Brothers Forever"
The first Marine female pilot was Sarah Deal , and she pinned her wings on 21 April 1995 ,she flew Ch53E"s with 466, but she never flew any combat flights. So if the female in the picture is for real Slick must be right she wa a he. SF
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="4"]I still call BS.Originally Posted by Al Barbour
See Walt's post below.
I see that you are gender inspecific, re; this 'person'.
Why is his, er, her name and squadron, withheld.
One other thing, if Beamon ever gets around to this thread, 'Who is Richard Blumenthal'?[/SIZE][/FONT]
Last edited by Allan Holmes; 05-22-2010 at 12:56.
Surely It should be considered for an appointment to a Presidential Cabinet "Slot". Conn has some vacancies also recently.
PM
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="5"]Hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, but just yesterday you wrote, to a friend, of mine-[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="5"][/SIZE][/FONT]From this information, the entire Connecticut Marine Corps League is filled with phonies. They will not release her name, squadron, years of service or DD-214. Where did she earn her Purple Heart, her Air Medal? Sam Beamon, formerly of HMM-164, should be ashamed.
http://pownetwork.org/phonies/phonies528.htm
Mystery to me.
Allan,
My first statement was based on a knee-jerk reaction to what I perceived as a phony, in a privileged communication with Dan, and addressed to him. It reflected my gut feeling toward a phony; my gut feeling toward phonies has not changed. After talking to Sam Beamon, a long time friend, and others, I was able to accept the findings as unfortunate but reasonable. I cannot say that I disagree with your opinion, but your opinions, and my opinions, are just that. Time to move on - or change the law. I am still waiting for a name, squadron and DD-214.
S/F Al
Last edited by Al Barbour; 05-24-2010 at 07:45. Reason: Add comment
They say they viewed the DD214: If the awards etc were earned in Vietnam does the DD214 show a He/She or whatnot !! If it shows a He than they obviouly are off base. Very simple to just show the DD 214 and the individuals name !!
PM
The commandant of the CT MCL stated he checked with the Detachment at Hardware City and was told a DD 214 was on file, and therfore stated it was valid.
Mr Carrier of the Hardware City Det, state it was a need to know basic, and apparently we did not need to know her name.
quote-"
don't know who you are, or who you think you are, but you are OUT of ORDER.
You do NOT have the NEED-to-KNOW. The Chain of Command is in charge, and in control.
So butt out and MYOB."
One would think that if a member of any Service org was in question, they would jump right in and verfity or double check the DD-214 thru St louis.
Therin lies the rub. No name. Now, how would you proceed to verify a DD-214 if the name is not the one now being used???? Does that automatically make them a phony? I know you are great at rooting out phonies and I applaud your efforts. Sometimes there are no right or perfect answers.
Enough said !!! Therefore DD 214 is a previous "HE" or how could it be explained ??? If a He, than the story is BS.
PM
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="4"]OK, a question for the smart guys.
Iffen Bob Smith served in VietNam, as a Naval Aviator, 'earned' the PH, CAR, AM, etal, and returns to CONUS.
He then figgers he is a woman in a man's body, so he gets a chop here, a slice there, some injections or whatever, does Betty Smith, now a SHE, rate his awards?[/SIZE][/FONT]
and a friend added -
[FONT="Georgia"]Sure is to bad that our contry has come to This! Not to disrespect this He her but it sure show's the battle line have been drawn and its put our world up side down. I respect the awards and the person that recieve them . With That I would just say this.......Whoever
(He or She) they got to still know they come from a Daddy and a Mommy..1 each and GOD made them so hope they getunconfused. God Bless the USA and the Marine corp! [SIZE="3"][/SIZE][/FONT]
J.J. HALL( Jerry)
Many people have a legal change of name. that info could be obtained thru the Freedom of Information Act, regardles of if in the military or not, if that could be the case.
My only reason of trying to follow up on this ,is the RVN ribbons she is wearing.
Maybe I got off base myself, She is a Marine Veteran. the fact the MCL has her DD 214 on file may show she is/was in the Corps, in order to join there Org, but does not mean all the ribbons she is wearing are infact true.
Semper Fi
I think I have to stand behind Sam on this. I have known him for over 10 years and is a stand up guy. He may spread the BS a little thick and he loves the written word (he is an author) but I have not heard him lie about something like this. He told me he challenged the Detachment Commandant on this. He was given a REASONABLE and PLAUSIBLE explanation. This person was then accepted into the MCL. Protocol and chain of comand were followed. Now, if this all comes out at total BS then I owe you and Bob Fowles an apology. Until then, I stand behind Sam. Was not real happy that Bob then started questioning the number of helo bubbas that had not only the Air Crew Wings, but the CAR as well. I don't question the integrity of any helo combat aircrewman.
Yes, awards stay with that person that earned them. So if he becomes a she, they are still HER awards.
He, She, or It.
This person obviously is lacking in courage, ashamed of something, or maybe committing a crime.
Why share your secret with an MCL detachment and not your real brothers in arms?
Most of us do not care what you became as long as you have been true to yourself, your family, and your fellow combat Marines.
Why go through the trouble of wearing the uniform, in public, and then refuse to identify yourself?
If I was going to stuff my fat body into a set of blues for the Ball, I would go all the way and buy Evening Mess Dress with Cape. Now that would be cool! Fortunately, I cannot afford to be cool.
Oh, I get it; it was a costume party and everyone attending was a wannabe!
On the face of it, this person is a phony, a fraud. Until someone gives a public, uncensored explanation of this person's credentials, the MCL is as phony as some of its members/guests.
Semper fi,
Wayne Sutter
Fighting Mad 1 - 4 Actual, Out
WHAT?? WHAT??
I'm sure everyone has an opinion on this, but the only thing I can say is this is not the school I was brought up in. It is my understanding that the only Marines to wear the uniform are active duty and retirees (I could be wrong on this). This is too hot and I'm sure it won't be long before a name is revealed. Rather this person is a He or a She or Whatever, why didn't they just stay in the closet if they want to stay incognito. Makes me want to barf.
S/F
Pops Powell
Amen...!!!
Last edited by Jim Wilkening; 05-23-2010 at 12:53. Reason: Capitalization
Come on Sam give us the straight scoop!
Semper Fi
Tim
Wow !!!
No surprises here..,right from the get-go. I've appreciation for everyone's comments & concur. Sure has opened up a can of worms.
In a time when being a Vietnam vet is now "popular" as opposed to being considered in the same light as flatulence at the dinner table..,it goes without saying.,that most of us will "zoom" in on fruit salad displayed on a person's chest.
There's a passel of posers & phonies out there. It puts my knickers in a twist..,as with those of us that have "been there/done that".
I've no problem with her/his/herm's display of wings & other awards..,if genuine. Obviously,the DD214 was checked out by qualified sources.
At the risk of turning this into a political forum.,when did our beloved Corps become so tolerant ??? Sad.
Also.,he/she/shim IS out of uniform.
S/F,Mike
TAKE NO PRISONERS.,SHOW NO MERCY.
DEATH SMILES AT EVERYONE...,MARINES SMILE BACK...
I'll Move ON
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="3"]Guess I'll move on and check the rest of the world. Sure it would be nice to know for sure,but then some would say we should start Right From the TOP. Now there is a loaded Gun if I ever saw One. Do we we REALLY have a President or is He just playing the role? I understand there are things that have not been spell out in truth to this day. Now How about that! What if He really isn't the rightful One ???? Now This IS BIG TIME TO ME anyways.
J.J. HALL( Jerry)
Clearing my Head
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="3"]Clearing my head and I guess I just did.............Took a lot off sure does feel better anyways Now maybe I can rest tonight. Semper FI and God Speed those Prayers for each and everyone of you and America......[/SIZE][/FONT]
J.J. HALL( Jerry)
Never mind!
Last edited by cnowotny; 05-24-2010 at 14:53. Reason: HTML Mrs. Takes
Semper Fidelis
Charle'
Ladies, Gentlemen, Friends Marines and you former Marines, this is my question:
Re: http://www.mcldeptct.org/234th%20Mar...day_H/MCL.html
What is legitimate and what is illegitimate?
What the Captain has and hasn’t displayed on the uniform.
1.The Purple Heart
2. Air Medal w/2*,
3. Combat Action Ribbon Awarded for Ground Combat Action Usually denied Air Crews
No Presidential Unit citations w/ Ribbon bar
4. Navy Unit Commendations with ribbon Bar and any subsequent stars
No good conduct medals ???
5. National Defense
6. Vietnam Service
No RVN meritorious Unit Citation Gallantry Cross ?
No RVN Meritorious Unit Citation civil Actions (First Class)?
7. Republic Vietnam Campaign
Expert Rifle and Pistol Qual Badges
On the DD 214 and possibly a DD 215 correction there is one piece of information that is critical to make it creditable and authentic , I.e. a name.
?
- Lt. Georga Onmymind,
- Captain Roberta Whazizerface.
- Major Charlene What Chu Tawkin Bout Willis,
- Colonel Arlena Sanders or
- General Dipsy Dumpster??
I see the following visuals:
{Indent}Captains Bars[/Indent]
- A Purple Heart
- An Air Medal Ribbon with /2* device (usually indicating a second award) 40 missions
- A Combat Action Ribbon Awarded for Ground Combat Action??? (Usually not given to Airedales who get Air Medals instead.)
- A Navy Marine Corps Commendation Ribbon
- The National defense ribbon
- The Vietnam Service Medal Ribbon (Sans about 4*’s)
- The Republic of Vietnam campaign Medal Ribbon
What is inexplicably missing from the photo are:
The Heroic Connecticut state Attorney General Richard Blumenthal (D) Claiming he in entitled to multiple flowery heroux awards because he bravely sat through multiple tours of:
- “Apocalypse Now Redux,
- A Midnight Clear,
- Platoon,
- Full Metal Jacket,
- Saving Private Ryan,
- Black Hawk Down,
- all ten episodes of Band of Brothers and
- The Pacific
- Anna Nicole Smith does Quantico
Where he was egregiously wounded like John F [ Flüsterwitz ] Kerry by his own ricocheting licorice DOT and a cherry Ju Ju Be while throwing these deadly missiles along with some some thunderous unpopped Popcorn at the menacing enemy soldiers as they appeared with their foaming horrid mien of blood thirsty drooling rictus on the silver screen.
Regardez!
Concerning the awards worn on the uniform…
Presidential Unit Citation with ribbon Bar,
Navy Unit Commendation with ribbon bar and at least 2 or more*
Any number of Good Conduct Ribbons
Republic of South Vietnam Meritorious Unit Citation Gallantry Cross
Republic of Vietnam Meritorious Unit Citation Civil Actions (First Class)
Now, the Republic of South Vietnam and Republic of Vietnam awards were usually awarded without the recipient knowing he or she rated and was entitled to wear the awards. That would usually be found out much later per a DD 215 correction form to the DD214.
Now, I have experienced a few instances of Stolen Valor similar to that which we see with Richard “The Dick” Blumenthal in Connecticut, John F. “The Flüsterwitz” Kerry in Massachusetts and a certain James Hagar in Missouri.
After I left the Corps, I became involved in Law Enforcement and I was always appalled when some higher ranking but not superior LUMPS as I called them; using a personal neologism or a Nowotnonymn of; [ Little Upwardly Mobile Police Supervisors] would make the claim that he [I never experienced a she] was a Vietnam Veteran or was a former Marine or a former Marine Combat Vietnam veteran and… wasn’t! This happened more than just one isolated time in my life’s experience, It happened in fact a few times, more than I really needed, especially with some inept police lieutenants and even some damn height challenged narcissistic good for nothing much other than a paperweight Captains who couldn’t pass a mirror without the mirrors mystical power overcoming him and he then coming to a screeching halt, executing a smart right or left face maneuver giving itself an approving look, a quick adjustment or two, a brush, a slight philip as IT admired its own reflection of the “Little Lard McFarquuard” LUMP looking out from the penumbra of the mystical mirror.
[Now for your etymologists out there, note that LUMPS has nothing to do with the social term Lumpenproletariat, although in my certainly biased opinion, one who pretend sin life that dreams are real certainly does live in an ethereal realm of that psychological fringe society that suffers from a case Bonnet Syndrome, possibly in Mittyville, down in Thurber County, U.S.of A.]
Why would someone publish such a controversial photo without an explanation? It has been my experience that when people are consciously vague they are attempting to hide something or do not want the light of truth to expose whatever it is they are conscious or subconscious ashamed of. It does not have to be an evil minded or demented thing at all, it could simply be that there is some easy describable physical or physiological answers to turn what is "pogy bait" for non constructive criticism and mean spirited debate to a lovely “Awww, that’sa nice”. No shame in that, the shame would be if someone is ashamed of the truth and is attempting to hide the truth with half truths, non truths, innuendo and WTF. Sooooooooooo, Isuggest that before we all sally forth and make some harsh uniformed judgement, let us allow those involved to answer up and explain the questionable photo. My lard, where is Paul Harvey with, “The rest of the story?” Telling us which was, who was, the pilot that honorably served the Marines as a man and found out he was really more comfortable as a female? Then maybe they can answer: Why does this WM officer not wear all of the awards he or she is entitled to?
Personally, I recommend the presentation of the self inflicted H.U.T.A. award with flowing SNAFU ribbon and three bright and shiny FUBIS Stars for whomever it was in the Connecticut Marine Corps League Administration, is responsible stirring up this baño and is allowing this to happen without a creditable explanation or a customary citation of the photo.
If legitimate; “ Semper Fidelis”, if found to be simply bullshit, then a stinking oozing Booooooooooorah and into the baño to the melodic strumming of dueling bañjo’s .
Glossary of Terms:
Flüsterwitz: A whispering Joke.
baño : The head.
Last edited by cnowotny; 05-24-2010 at 14:59. Reason: MRS'd HTML TAGS
Semper Fidelis
Charle'
I concurr with the above and these 3 are all of the culprits involved. The 2 males are probably not "wingers" and never rode in a helicopter assault.TWO: If taken, the pic should have remained in the CN MCL files only. the release of the picture has stained the image of our fellow Marines!
This photo was taken off the Detachment website and was posted by an individual on another website - and the battle was on.
[SIZE="4"][FONT="Georgia"]Where is the self promoting Beamon on all of this.
Com'on Sam, you vouched for it/her/he/she/him.
Where is all of this DD-214 documentation.
Iffen it/her/he/she/him is legit (and I call bullshit there), then why can't it/her/he/she/him even wear the proper awards.
I have been busted off this site before, but if this one 'person' passes muster, I will say some shit to get busted off again.
... and iffen it/her/he/she/him is found to be a phony, then all those that stood up for it/her/he/she/him, whether they be PAS big big nuts or not, THEY should be busted.[/FONT][/SIZE]
Last edited by Allan Holmes; 05-24-2010 at 16:32.
Larry, & et al
I have thoroughly perused the Hardware City MCL detachment website, and ...
The on going theme on ALL of their pic pages in all galleries, is a penchant
for NO IDENTIFICATION of ANYBODY.
Of considerable interest is the fact that Richard Blumenthal holds a popular
position in most annual galleries back to 2004. There appears to be a tacit
acceptance of him in their detachment. I did not do a count of the pictures
of him, but let it be said, he was no stranger.
Btw --- the "star" on "her" AM appears to be a SILVER one, representing
the 5th Award.
One other comment:
I believe that the Good Conduct Medal was an Enlisted Only Award.
Last edited by Mike Amtower; 05-24-2010 at 16:43.
There I was, happily surfing the web when I got an [This here] email telling me to come here and read this here.
Now I gotta tell ya? There are a million ways a Female Woman Marine of the opposite sexual persuasion could get to be a Captain, in Vietnam, become a qualified pilot, earn a purple heart, have two Air Medals, get a Combat Action Ribbon, get a couple of Navy Unit Commendations plus get the National Defense Ribbon and the RVN Service and the RVN Campaign ribbon. I will list them all below...
[SIZE="5"]1. ?[/SIZE]
Well at least there must be a Trillion as in Obama ways for a United States Marine Corps Captain to NOT get any good conduct ribbons, NOT get any PUC's and NOT get any RVN Crosses of gallantry and civic Actions awards. I'll List them ALL below.
[SIZE="5"]1. ?[/SIZE]
Well, maybe the Captain was in the Navy for a year or two before laterally moving over across the street to the Marine Corps or maybe she was an 03 prior to getting a battle field commission for killing Krauts at the battle of the Marne or something or another, and maybe the Captain wasn’t capable of earning a good conduct medal and got into trouble at a local bar, like going AWOL at Dien Bien Phu or while in-country R&R or while in Hong Kong or while visiting Wally’s World? Or maybe she had a sick headache that day and missed out on that award given out by Capt'n Crunch. Probably like many, got into trouble at a local bar in DaNang, Tijuana or in the tenderloin Dist. of San Francisco?
In any case, since no one wants to fess up and clear up the imbroglio, and let this thing take on a life of its own, just use poetic license like the imposters do and make it up as you go along, just make it unfreeking believably heroic so as to make the young girls whimper and cry and get free drinks at the bar..
Why I got my DD 214, my DD 215 and My SPECIAL DD 216 .5 which due to its sensitivity, is only reviewable at in WashingtonD.C., at 8th & I under the supervision of an armed General Officer holding a Bulldog on a leash. Why everyone knows The DD 216 was given only to those of us unique individuals who have unselfishly and secretly saved the universe from invading blood sucking, puss licking legions of Obama’s Corpsemen and rabid and ribald Zombies from the noxious, gaseous world of MoeHowardavania located just ouside of Moronavakia and its rogue moon, CurlyJoeuhtainia. You can Czech it out. It was also the number of my cub scout pack in grade school.
Good Godfrey Daniels?????
Semper Fidelis
Charle'
The stars on the Air Medals were for single mission Air Medals. There should be numbers example: 200 missions = 10 Air Medals. I don't see any numbers on the Air Medal. I know some Marine helo drivers had 50+. I was just an average UH-1 pilot and I got 46 during my 12 months in country.
If I am not mistaken ................
That appears to be Sam Beamon standing at "her" left shoulder.
http://www.mcldeptct.org/index.html
Check this link. That is a PDD (Pedigreed Devil Dog) neck ribbon
on the Marine on the right.
Compare the pics in the link above (un-dated) and next to "her".
Last edited by Mike Amtower; 05-24-2010 at 17:28.
He has more hair and is younger looking.
BTW - Where is Sam Beamon? He is running 3 different investigations on the 3 different MCL Detachments that were on stage with the aforementioned Mr. Blumenthal because they violated a bunch of different MCL regs and his tenure in office is over in 3 weeks.
[SIZE="4"]http://pownetwork.org/phonies/phonies528.htm[/SIZE]
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="5"]Well Sam, lets hear it.[/SIZE][/FONT]Delivered-To: info@pownetwork.org
From: Crewchf164@aol.com
Date: Thu, 20 May 2010 23:45:41 EDT
Subject: Re: Fw: MCL phonies in Connecticut
To: info@pownetwork.org
I have stated that this person is qualified to wear those medals and wings. Her DD-214 is on file. You are right about the first female helicopter pilot.
Enough has been said.
Sam Beamon
Right you be, Allyn.
A good friend of mine has a "26" on his and 3 single mission stars.
If this be true, then "she" WAS NOT a WM flying Hueys in Vietnam!You are right about the first female helicopter pilot. --- Sam Beamon
Is Beamon referring to:
.... with his "you are right ..... " statement?Sarah Deal was the first Marine pilot and she pinned her wings on 21 April, 1995.
Last edited by Mike Amtower; 05-24-2010 at 18:44.
Sam isn't in any of the pictures with the BAM. The only place I saw a picture of Sam was at one of the CN state functions, not at the Marine Corps Birthday the BAM was pictured in. Maybe it's some kind of joke, but not funny and disrespectful to our Corps. Just my 2 cents!
Semper Fi
Tim
It's NOT a "joke", Tim ......
...... and the Hardware City Detachment is in for some "hard" times.
Beamon being a Department Officer, (check out pic in my previously provided link)
has his work cut out for him. The Commandant of the Department of Connecticut,
the HEAD dude!
"3 investigations" ... huh, Larry?
Last edited by Mike Amtower; 05-24-2010 at 18:48.
Sam is the current Commandant of the MCL for the state of CT. What actually what DET he came from I have no idea.
This is a photo of Sam from the State of CT website
http://www.mcleague.org/mdp/userpage...ONNECTICUT.php
Mike I don't see any pictures of Sam there, if it is a fluke he may know nothing about it. I wouldn't start messing with Sam until this stuff gets put through the wringer and I'm sure you'll find Sam had no knowledge of it. Don't start pointing fingers at Sam! Everybody should just calm down until we get to the bottom of this. Sam will surface and tell us what he knows, maybe he is researching and laying low until he knows the real truth.
Semper Fi
Tim
As I recall in '67 / '68 the subsequent award of an Air Medal was in the form of a small silver star device. There weren't many multiple Air Medals awarded in those early years, at least not like in late '68 and '69 etc. Later after Tet in September of 1968 the Corps started the strike / flight numerals to designate multiple awards due to so many multiple awards being given. Single mission Air Medals were disignaged with a "V" device See example of Air Medal with the strike /flight awards, multiple awards post Sept 1968 and single Mission Air Medal. The ones in the photo attached are gold.
Naval Officers with the rank of Captain (or Colonel in the Marine Corps) are not eligible for award of the Air Medal on a strike/flight basis unless the sorties they fly are required in the performance of their regular duties.
Strikes are missions that deliver ordnance against the enemy, land or evacuate personnel in an assault, or in which personnel are engaged in search and rescue operations. The distinguishing feature of a strike is that it encounters enemy opposition.
Flights are missions that deliver ordnance against the enemy, land or evacuate personnel in an assault, or in which personnel are engaged in search and rescue operations but does not encounter enemy opposition. [I.E. a milk run from Phu Bai to Danang when the Zips at Hai Van Pass were asleep or on R&R.]
Regarding Sam Beamons awareness. Yes it seems by his endorsement that he is fully aware of this issue and the below email indicates that Sam knows something about these photos and this chapter.
The question is, what files are these DD-214 on file with. Where are they kept? With whom are they on file. The MCL of Conn. or the official St. Louis Mo. files. Maybe Dan Rather would rather NOT check this out?
Delivered-To: info@pownetwork.org
From: Crewchf164@aol.com
Date: Thu, 20 May 2010 23:45:41 EDT
Subject: Re: Fw: MCL phonies in Connecticut
To: info@pownetwork.org
I have stated that this person is qualified to wear those medals and wings. Her DD-214 is
on file. You are right about the first female helicopter pilot.
Enough has been said.
Sam Beamon
I doubt that the last shoe has dropped on this one.
Last edited by cnowotny; 05-24-2010 at 19:36. Reason: Too many secrets, way too many secrets.
Semper Fidelis
Charle'
Good Marine
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="3"]Sure thing Tim none of us should do any finger pointing because it may just come back to bit us. Slowing down and let this take its course is a good idea. For any of you others ,I will say that this really needs to be clear up so we can put it to rest . Pray all of us will do just that and give it some time. Not Ten years ! Semper Fi Tim and to ALL you Marines. God Speed these answers too.[/SIZE][/FONT]
J.J. HALL( Jerry)
[SIZE="4"][FONT="Georgia"]
EDITED!!!
After reflection and reconsideration, on a 14-1/2 hour flight, I have come to the conclusion that my comments were inappropriate. For this I apologize to the PAS leadership, as I was not directed to them as a whole.
This person, and the MCL she belongs to, should be ashamed of themselves. If this is indeed a he/she, it makes me wonder why the uniform or ribbon placement is incorrect, not to forget missing pieces.
To me, this is a slap in the face to all true Veterans of the little conflict we participated in over the beautiful skies of SE Asia.
I for one, sleep well at night, with a clear conscience, knowing that I was there, and do not have an issue with folks questioning my service. (Yes, it has happened.)
The sad part about this is that it has happened. I will, however, withhold all comments and let the smart folks sort this out.[/FONT][/SIZE]
Noticed this AM, that the POWNetwork/Phonies posting that started this has disappeared.
So, I sent an e-mail asking, WHY? Below is the response I received.
Semper fi,
Wayne Sutter
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: P.O.W. Network - Chuck and Mary Schantag <info@pownetwork.org>
To: wayne sutter <sutterwl@att.net>
Subject: Re: female phony at MCL Connecticut detachment?
Date: 05/26/2010 12:24:48 PM (Wed, 26 May 2010 11:24:48 -0500)
WE asked for the ID on the photo.
Got a tentative ID last night. Requesting records.
It is believed that HE earned the awards.
Mary
At 09:01 AM 5/26/2010, wayne sutter wrote:
>What happened to your posting regarding this person's identity?
>
>Every Marine Aviator/Vietnam Vet is entitled to know this person's
>identity. Or, is your organization part of the coverup, too?
>
>Semper fi,
>
>Wayne Sutter, USMCR(forever)
>104 Meadowcross Drive
>Safety Harbor, FL 34695
>HMM-165, HMM-362, 3/3/3
There is only one correct answer to how this could be; she served in Vietnam as a male. I know for a fact that there was one Army pilot who had the same history. When I was at Fort Rucker getting checked out in the UH-60 in 1987 everyone there knew her story, and no one really cared she was accepted as a fellow aviator.
I cannot speak for Pop A Smoke, but as for me I'd be glad to have her attend our reunions, and I'm sure all of her squadron mates would be glad to welcome her aboard for a good time. I'd just love to sell her a few patches from her old squadrons, and share any good stories she has to tell. No matter what any of us chose to do after we got off active duty we will always be U.S. Marines.
As for the CAR I know it was given for ground action. I may or may not have quilified: see Photo Archive #424 Cpl Miles Alexander and I caputred a VC in May 1970 the story at the time got enough attention to get written up in Leatherneck, but no one ever put in the paper work for any award, and I really didn't care then or now, but I'd like to hear her story.
If she is for real I'd be proud to stand with her, and ready to defend her as a fellow Vietnam Vet.
Last edited by Allyn Hinton; 05-26-2010 at 19:39. Reason: spelling error
Wow, what a thread.
GOOD Marine
[FONT="Georgia"][SIZE="3"]Good Marine ! It take a Good man,but a better Marine to see all sides. Allan ,but I can say I do see your point and so just want to let you know. God Speed , Hope to see you in Reno![/SIZE][/FONT]
J.J. HALL( Jerry)
Ribbon/medal precedence has changed since we were in. PH out ranks the AM now.
The Argumentum ad verecundiam of Sam Beamon and this silly set syllogism’s?.
1st.
The Purple Heart to the best of my knowledge has always held precedence to the Air Medal as it should.
My question is that there are a few rules of logical investigation needed to explain the argumentum ad verecundiam of Sam Beamon’s email response?
2nd
A simple modus tollens would suffice, not counting a sharpened Occams Razor or any of the lovely laws of Parsimony or [KISS].
I have to ask, ‘If the pictured combat awards were earned as an enlisted man, where are the PUC's, where are the Republic of Vietnam ribbons? Where is the enlisted Good Conduct Ribbon? Where then are the hash mark(s) denoting all those years of enlisted service, and shouldn’t there be a Marine Combat Aircrew Badge?
Yes, I know..., The Air Combat wasn’t medals weren't awarded as an Officer. So where izzit @?
There are no other campaign ribbons to denote any other subsequent actions in which he may have participated.
Panama,
Granada,
Beirut, etc.
Oh, right! I forgot, an officer should never make any reference to the circumstances as how he earned his commission.
I am trying my best to use a simple hypothetical syllogism here even though it is very disjunctive, I am aware that Officers don't rate GCM's or our “Good Cookie Award” but that is my point! If she is now an officer, how did this occur even if she was an enlisted male in the Marines or the Navy in her youth? [SIZE="5"]So,[/SIZE] if Alan is wrong, a fortiori, so am I but I doubt it in all earnest.
I am to believe and accept that this she-male earned the Combat awards as an enlisted person in some naval service of the United States as an enlisted man. Long before the Progressive “Don’t Ask Don’t tell” rules were even ever considered. Now why do I find that confusing???
Then he became an officer, then rose to the rank of Captain after completing flight school where he became a Marine or Naval pilot? Then he may have left the Navy and joined or rejoined the Corps as a pilot or didn't? Then, after a bit he addressed his transsexual issues and became a female Marine. Presumably after don’t ask don’t tell, but that is oh so wrong. She did this all very clandestinely and never aroused any attention to herself..., that is until.., [Ahem!] now ?
I don't believe even Smedley Butler, Chesty Puller or Leslie O'Banion could have done all of that above in under four (4) years since no enlisted hash mark in evidence? But Officers don't wear Hash Marks, I gott’em on my Blues, was I out of uniform? Where do I go to have my sene qua non Cap’n’s Mast or a belatred General Court Marshal?
Long after I was discharged from the Marines on a fluke and a dare, I had occasion to join an Army Military Police Company as a reservist as did a few of my Marine buddy’s and Law Enforcement cohorts. I (we) wore my (our) USMC ribbons and my USMC badges, even wore my Air Combat badge on my utilities at drills and Summer Camps just to confuse the Army Reserve Knimbknowls. I got rank, I got awards but I doubt if I’d ever consider wearing any of the Army Reserve “Geedunk” on my Marine Corps Dress Blues for my FUNeral even it they did fit and I could legally wear my Dress Blues again.
Oh well, Thus endeth the epistle, that’s my apercu for today, so much for last months espièglerie and this etourderie gaucherie.
Laissez les bon temps rouler, and a polyglots to all.
Siempre fiel, Altijd Gelovig, Toujours fidèle, Immer Zuverlässig, Vždy věrný, Sempre fedele, Zawsze wierny, 常に忠実な
Semper Fidelis
[FONT="Fixedsys"]All done in fun until someone fesses up![/FONT]
Semper Fidelis
Charle'
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